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Visit abave's column >>

ABAVE

Articles Posted: 5  Links Seeded: 0
Member Since: 4/2009  Last Seen: 5/01/2009

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And how patriotic are you?

Tue Apr 21, 2009 8:46 PM EDT
politics, christian, patriotic
By abave
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"We are not a Christian nation, a Jewish nation, or a Muslim nation. We are a nation of citizens."- President Obama.

I received a call from my mother last night, she is visiting friends and family in Oregon. Her friend is a conservative Christian, my mom is what you would call liberal. After a night of political debate/attack, where my mother had to listen to how the liberals are destroying our country and tearing apart this Christian nation, she called me to vent. Listening to the recap of that nights diatribe felt like a disturbing case of dejavu. I have heard all of these attacks before. If you are against the war in Iraq you are for the terrorist. If you don't advocate for torture you are soft and want your country to be attacked. If you are for universal health care you are a socialist and unpatriotic. Unpatriotic.

I have a pocket Constitution I carry with me every where I go. I watch the news at least 8 hours a day and know most of Congress by name and state. I love my country and care deeply about the direction that it is heading. So to say that I am unpatriotic is like claiming Madden hates football. Unpatriotic. How patriotic is the average American? How do you quantify patriotism? How many people vote in every election, I mean during school-board, local judge, and city council elections too? If asked right now, do you know where your voter registration card is? Do you know who your district judge is? Have you read the constitution, not just for a school assignment ten years ago, but in your spare time?

How often do you read the constitution?

Now, how often do you read the bible?

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  • Public Discussion (14)
R.Francis Rubio

That's the number one play in the Republican playbook! Ever since 1994 the plan was to pick controversial issues, divide the country and hope to turn at least 1% over to their side for the win!

It worked for a while, until we the people caught on to their game!

  • 4 votes
Reply#1 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 10:01 PM EDT
JoulesBeef

well to be fair both sides do that.. lately the gop took it to new levels
but yeah their will alwasy be referendums designed to get you to vote cause something horrible will happen if you dont.
min wage, marijuana for the dems, gay marriage and abortion for the gop.
and we often get people that belong to the unspoken corporate party.

    #1.1 - Wed Apr 22, 2009 3:11 AM EDT
    Reply
    debmo-571638

    I would die for my country in a legitimate war. If enemies were on our soil, I would stand armed and defend and I hate guns. I have done my best to accept GWB as our President. But I will protest the government when they step over the bounds of rule of law. GWB and his administration did this so I protest the idea that they will go free. My love of country has nothing to do with God. Everyone's relationship with God is unique but everyone should love their country completely through good and bad. I love my country, I will defend my country and I will dissent when the elected government goes stupid.

    • 2 votes
    Reply#2 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 10:17 PM EDT
    sharon-734350

    time to start your dissent!!

      #2.1 - Wed Apr 22, 2009 11:27 AM EDT
      Reply
      Csp

      If you are against the war in Iraq you are for the terrorist. If you don't advocate for torture you are soft and want your country to be attacked. If you are for universal health care you are a socialist and unpatriotic.

      After hearing similar comments for the last 8 years I have become a firm beliver in the old saying "dissent is the highest form of patriotism"

      • 1 vote
      Reply#3 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 10:53 PM EDT
      abave

      It worked for a while, until we the people caught on to their game!

      My question is: Have they?

      If you watch the news long enough these labels are still thrown around on a daily basis. Rep. Bachus, in a very McCarthy-esque fashion was going to oust 17 "socialist" in Congress; why? Because of universal health care. The right wing media jumped all over that, which propelled a conversation in all main-stream media about the possibility of socialist in our government. How is this even a legitimate debate?

      What bothers me is the belief that you can't be patriotic and 1)find flaws/fault in your country, and 2)believe that you can find guidance in the success of other countries 3)be something other than christian.

        Reply#4 - Tue Apr 21, 2009 11:23 PM EDT
        metonitoo

        abave- metoni says, "me too." You only have to read the Newsvine Posts to see the very points you have made.- Thanks, i needed you article.

          #4.1 - Wed Apr 22, 2009 2:11 AM EDT
          Reply
          Levin FanDeleted
          midgebaker

          Recommended reading, from famed science fiction writer Robert A. Heinlein, the author of the books on which "The Red Planet" and "Starship Troopers" ,ovies were based:

          "The Pragmatics of Patriotism"

          http://westernrifleshooters.blogspot.com/2008/03/pragmatics-of-patriotism.html

          "This I Believe"

          http://www.rjgeib.com/thoughts/athens/heinlein-i-believe.html

          Robert Heinlein quotes:

          "Political tags - such as royalist, communist, democrat, populist, fascist, liberal, conservative, and so forth - are never basic criteria. The human race divides politically into those who want people to be controlled and those who have no such desire. "

          "When any government, or any church for that matter, undertakes to say to its subjects, This you may not read, this you must not see, this you are forbidden to know, the end result is tyranny and oppression no matter how holy the motives."

          "You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once."

          The truest patriotic thought is embodied in the cry "women and children first!!"

            Reply#6 - Wed Apr 22, 2009 1:51 AM EDT
            metonitoo

            The Civil War taught Our 'Baby-Nation' the "What is Patriotism Message."

              #6.1 - Wed Apr 22, 2009 2:14 AM EDT
              Reply
              sharon-734350

              We are a nation of Christianity..our country was founded by our Christian fore fathers. This President has no visable commtment to any thing of religious consequence that i can see. but i do see him patronizing other foreign countries and their religious beliefs. I thought he was a American President with christian values....looks like we were all fooled by this man.

                Reply#7 - Wed Apr 22, 2009 11:24 AM EDT
                abave

                He is an American President with American values. Which I think is more inclusive. This belief that we are a christian nation goes against the foundation of our constitution.

                "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..." There is a reason that this is the first amendment. Our fore-fathers may have been christian (I think Jefferson was more agnostic, really *personal opinion*) but they knew that church based government will always be oppressive and inevitably corrupt. They started constitution in hopes to create a system to abolish said oppression and prevent corruption and intrusion from the church. The separation of church and state is to protect the state, not the other way around.

                • 3 votes
                #7.1 - Wed Apr 22, 2009 11:39 AM EDT
                Reply
                Fabliha

                I believe that Americans don't value patriotism as much as what the Founding Fathers hoped for their citizens to value. Americans today are more self indulgent. They value consumerism, fashion, movies, etc., over the value of their country. I believe only a few would stand up and volunteer to join the army if we had a World War today. I believe they lack the moral conception of appreciating the place they live in. For example, only a handful of people actually care deeply for planet earth.

                • 1 vote
                Reply#8 - Wed Apr 22, 2009 6:43 PM EDT
                RGValleyGal

                I agree that we are citizens, before we are considered as or counted per our religious beliefs. We each weave our beliefs into our own citizenship. Regarding the Constitution and government laws, the government cannot, and should not, mix church and state because our country may have started out with Christianity as the main belief, but now we are a nation of mixed religions. And that is something that will never change.

                This may seem extreme to most folks. I am Christian by belief and have strong ideas against elective abortion, capital punishment, and other topics and values. But being such a mixed nation, we will be continually butting heads with those of other beliefs and we cannot force ourselves on others. That would definitely hinge on prejudice. Our country is so diverse that prejudice has to be done away with.

                Hope what I said makes general sense without overshooting what others have said.

                JMHO

                  Reply#9 - Wed Apr 22, 2009 11:01 PM EDT
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